43 replies to this topic

[Hans]

This tech demo shows it all. That looks incredibly precise and responsive.

How someone could talk trash about this, yet talk up this:





ESPECIALLY coming from supposed 'hardcore gamers' -- is unbelievable to me.

Microsoft's showcase of their tech basically looked like the worst parts of the original Wii Mote to me. All of the gimmicky, imprecise, 'non-movements' to make it feel like you're doing something even though it's just an illusion. Nintendo has gotten it right with the Motion plus, Sony gets it right with their controller, but Microsoft totally gets it wrong.

There are technical hurdles as well. I have to imagine that with the way Microsoft's tech works, that the processing overhead would be pretty dramatic. They're having to do EVERYTHING via software for motion detection, while Sony and Nintendo are using a combination of hardware and software. Microsoft is going to have a shitload of issues with their tech, and it's going to be laggy as fuck. You could clearly see that it was both laggy, imprecise, and janky in their demonstrations.

[Everdred]

The Sony waggle wand seems pretty much identical to Wii Motion Plus. Given that it's being released as an add-on to a relatively low-selling system which caters to "hardcore" gamers, I can't see it doing anything other than failing.

[Hans]

It's similar, but looks more responsive and precise and also has the added benefit of having motion sensing capabilities in two portions of the controller instead of one.

[tyrone]

Yeah, both of the motion controls have an uphill battle on the HD consoles.

Natal is revolutionary, though. So it can succeed.

I can just imagine flipping through menus minority report style.

When I was a kid playing Atari 2600, on some shitty tube Tv with a channel dial, that would have DESTROYED MY MIND to imagine. But it's here.

[Bacon]

Neither company has any compelling games to go along with the devices and both are going to be playing catch-up with Nintendo for quite awhile. Does Sony's controller even have buttons? The thing I like about Wii is it's a happy medium between traditional controllers and motion controls.

I have to say, Microsoft's stuff was shit and is not the way I want to interact with games.

[Mackey]

360 camera is more impressive tech. im sure ms will release some controller for fps and whatnot.

[Hans]

Bacon, on 03 June 2009 - 06:40 AM, said:

Neither company has any compelling games to go along with the devices and both are going to be playing catch-up with Nintendo for quite awhile. Does Sony's controller even have buttons? The thing I like about Wii is it's a happy medium between traditional controllers and motion controls.

I have to say, Microsoft's stuff was shit and is not the way I want to interact with games.

Sony was just showing off the motion tech. they haven't shown off the controller, which will definitely have buttons.

I agree though, Nintendo's strong point is the software support.

Sony needs to have the same level of backing.

Like I said though, MotionPlus and SonyMotion are both steps in the right direction. Microsoft's stuff was garbage.

[Sambain]

Hans, on 03 June 2009 - 06:43 AM, said:

Microsoft's stuff was garbage.

Not really. The photocopying management teams at Sony and Microsoft both produced gimmicks. Strange that they never showed a Balance board copy.

[Hans]

http://multiplayerbl...era-watch-this/



Head tracking without glasses or anything like that.

[Bitchwax]

I can guarantee that the Wii Motion Plus devkit sandbox looks almost identical to some of the tech demos Sony showed off yesterday.

As for that head tracking Full body lean in 3D space allowing you to "blind fire" without the game deciding where the rest of your body is.

2 points of reference/control < Full 3D Skeletal Mapping

Bububu glitch GIF

[jdog]

Bitchwax, on 03 June 2009 - 09:29 AM, said:

I can guarantee that the Wii Motion Plus devkit sandbox looks almost identical to some of the tech demos Sony showed off yesterday.

As for that head tracking Full body lean in 3D space allowing you to "blind fire" without the game deciding where the rest of your body is.

2 points of reference/control < Full 3D Skeletal Mapping

Bububu glitch GIF

XFags

[Bitchwax]

I think Sony demonstrating their own shitty versions of Wii Sports Resort, Boom Blox and Red Steel is far funnier than an over the top presentation of a much better system

[Sambain]

Sony fans should stop loling at Microsoft's camera. None of my friends think any of this stuff is worhthwile. They just see it as Sony and Microsoft being desperate for attention.

[Bitchwax]

Pretty sure that Wii painting program is homebrew shit as well

Edited by Bitchwax, 03 June 2009 - 10:32 AM.

[hey69]

cant wait when it comes out, looks stunning. combined with a low price

[snagi]

yup motion device i love to try!

I hated play with the Wii waggle. Low precision = no feel of game input. As if like play Ninja Gaiden on a balloon gamepad.

This is true love for technology. CELL based image processing make Wii+ feel like a toy.

[Sambain]

A friend of mine made a very good observation. The fact that Microsoft and Sony (and all their fanboys) have reduced themselves into, "my waggle is better than your waggle", shows how completely dominant Nintendo is over the competition and how a complete failure and gimmick HD really is.

[lecuitis]

Haven't tried the Wii motion plus yet but this looks a shitton more precise than anything I've seen so far, so much so that this could replace the stick for traditional genres rather than having to come up with 'motion genre/non-game' shit to make use of it.
Hopefully this gets good support because I can't wait to play a solid game with this tech.

[olimario]

Yup.
Camera + Controller is the winning combo.
I really think that's the route Nintendo will use next go round.

[Lokidoki]

That looked cool but it's just Sony's version of Wii Motion Plus.

Natal seems newer, more revolutionary. But they are all just ways to play shit casual games. None of these are going to replace a controller in a game like Call of Duty or GT5, so who gives a fuck.

[olimario]

Loki-
Natal has no practical application because gamers want feedback.

And Sony's Motion Controller is true 1:1 and it tracks you in complete 3D space perfectly because of the camera. I really think it could replace a traditional controller.

[Lokidoki]

olimario, on 03 June 2009 - 02:55 PM, said:

Loki-
Natal has no practical application because gamers want feedback.

And Sony's Motion Controller is true 1:1 and it tracks you in complete 3D space perfectly because of the camera. I really think it could replace a traditional controller.

Who cares what gamers want? These things are geared towards the same thing the Wii is.. people who aren't gamers. They are cool to us real gamers for 10 minutes and then it's boring. But the idea of not using a controller at all is certainly more appealing to me than something like the Wii or what Sony showed, in which motions just replace pushing a button. The voice recognition will make it even better. Everything Sony showed off you could also do with Natal only you don't have to hold a controller to do it. You just use motions and voice.

And none of this will ever replace traditional controllers. It will never be as fluid, responsive or accurate as holding a real pad in your hands. That and some genres simply will never work. You can't play a FPS with this. You can't play Street Fighter IV with this.

[Annon]

I think Sony's controller offers more in the way of control for games as we traditionally know them, but Microsofts TECHNOLOGY is dramatically more impressive, and will allow for some new stuff.

People dismissing Natal are being retarded. Sony doesn't have an advantage here. Do you know how easy it would be to add controller tracking to Natal? With all the body tracking they are already doing, they could easily drop in a "glowing orb" controller and use sony's method in conjunction with the controllerless method.

[Sebastien Rayer]

Annon, on 03 June 2009 - 08:08 PM, said:

People dismissing Natal are being retarded.

Yes, we know Hans is retarded.

[ohmyxxx]

since natal does not need any wand or other pepherial you can still use the normal xbox controller in conjunction with natal.

thats why i think it can (but obviously wont) be put to good use in non casual non gimmicky one trick pony games.

[Barnaby Jones]

[Green Goblin]

Bacon, on 03 June 2009 - 06:40 AM, said:

Neither company has any compelling games to go along with the devices and both are going to be playing catch-up with Nintendo for quite awhile. Does Sony's controller even have buttons? The thing I like about Wii is it's a happy medium between traditional controllers and motion controls.

I have to say, Microsoft's stuff was shit and is not the way I want to interact with games.

That's only because you are ignorant of NATAL's abilities.

You can use a regular controller in conjunction with NATAL. Seeing how MS has the best controller, how the fuck can you beat it?

Can't do that with either of the other two faggot setups. Its either a normal controller or a gay waggle wand.

Edited by Green Goblin, 03 June 2009 - 09:39 PM.

[Ravi Drums]

Oh god motion control fanboys?

I like real games, give me a real controller.

Last time I checked Eye Toy sucked and Microsoft's and Sony's latest versions of it still look absolutely terrible.

[Hans]

Annon, on 03 June 2009 - 08:08 PM, said:

I think Sony's controller offers more in the way of control for games as we traditionally know them, but Microsofts TECHNOLOGY is dramatically more impressive, and will allow for some new stuff.

People dismissing Natal are being retarded. Sony doesn't have an advantage here. Do you know how easy it would be to add controller tracking to Natal? With all the body tracking they are already doing, they could easily drop in a "glowing orb" controller and use sony's method in conjunction with the controllerless method.

People thinking Natal is some revolutionary technology are retarded. This tech shit has been at tradeshows for years, and it's practical application for games is nonexistent. It's only applicable for non-game bullshit. And because everything is based upon intensive software processing, it's going to introduce lots of latency, lag, and glitches. What they showed at the conference was the worst in terms of precision and responsiveness.

Sure, they could easily 'drop in a controller', but they have suggested that they're NOT going to do that. Mattrick got up on stage and said that controllers were a thing of the past, and that the future is getting rid of any type of controller and doing everything through body movement. Did you even watch the conference?

Sony's tech looks fun as fuck for real games. Microsoft's tech looks like a CES/GDC tech demo. I don't care about moving around an interface with my hand, Minority Report style. That shit will get old quickly.

[Annon]

Hans, on 03 June 2009 - 11:22 PM, said:

People thinking Natal is some revolutionary technology are retarded. This tech shit has been at tradeshows for years, and it's practical application for games is nonexistent. It's only applicable for non-game bullshit. And because everything is based upon intensive software processing, it's going to introduce lots of latency, lag, and glitches. What they showed at the conference was the worst in terms of precision and responsiveness.

Sure, they could easily 'drop in a controller', but they have suggested that they're NOT going to do that. Mattrick got up on stage and said that controllers were a thing of the past, and that the future is getting rid of any type of controller and doing everything through body movement. Did you even watch the conference?

Sony's tech looks fun as fuck for real games. Microsoft's tech looks like a CES/GDC tech demo. I don't care about moving around an interface with my hand, Minority Report style. That shit will get old quickly.

I don't think you understand how natal works. It basically 3d maps your entire living room with infrared depth sensing cameras. It doesn't need a glowing orb to see that you are holding something in your hands, it can precisely tell exactly where your hands are. They could easily track what you are doing with your hands using the controller they already have right now. If that isn't what you want, they could easily make a wand they could pick up as well.

Sony's tech is what has been shown at tradeshows for years. I'm glad they are finally going to polish it and put it out there, but it is not a new concept. The stuff in natal is nothing like the technology we have seen before. Here is how natal sees things:



You should read up on how these two systems work, the way you are dismissing the tech behind natal, you clearly don't understand it.